Question Lecture for Artists

This is a very interesting thread indeed. Approximately ages ago when the earth's crust was cooling. I owned a retail art and framing business. I have years of having students or just graduates of art history, etc. working for me. Since I was the boss they had to listen even if they didn't agree with what I was telling them about preservation of art and framing in general. EVERY student that worked for me told me that they would never think of framing the same way and they had learned more about caring for art than any class they had taken. What's the point, well there is still a huge need to educate artists and art historians and probably those college professors and the way a thing is said means a lot. We don't frame to make the frame more important than the art. We frame to enhance the beauty of the art. In my shop I had customers drop off art to be framed and just call them when it was ready. I told them concerning those "white" mats that if color wasn't important then everything would be done in black & white. Don't be afraid to use color to enhance, and so long as the eye is drawn back to the art, the framing is a success. In a frame business you get plenty of work to frame that it's what you like or maybe even very good art, I thought it was my job to help the customer enjoy their art more by framing it well. This is my own method but this is how I decide in the simplest way possible if the thing I'm looking at is actually art...is doesn't matter if I personally like the piece. If I can walk right by it, it is wallpaper, but if I have to actually see the piece then is it art. I have also found that there is no one outside of this business (and some inside this business) who actually understand the vocabulary of this business. So I would suggest either a handout of something of that nature that you can go over with them and that they can refer to while you are teaching. I have done some of this at our local university as a guest speaker and I found the students/artists very receptive.
 
Good input, Lois.

By the time this thread is finished (for now anyways) there will be a wealth of info in here for the FTA - Future Talkers of Art.
 
I am working on a brief bio for the art group's newsletter and it occurred to me that UI ought to come up with a clever title for my presentation.

Something like those Reader's Digest cover stories - "10 secrets framers want artists to know" comes to mind, or a riff on Ellen's idea: "Does your framer hate you?" or "How to keep your framer from hating you," or "How to make your framer love you."

Any ideas? I want something kinda humorous/serious. Like someone said - needs to draw them in to the evening's festivities.

I plan on making handouts for them to take home with a lot of the covered info. So - do I give them out before the presentation and risk having someone reading during my talk, or give them out afterward and risk having them filed in the circular file on their way out the door?
 
Speak slowly...... and show them pictures that were taken in the Louvre.....
not in an art book.

All of their education (or lack there of) was from a book that had
few, if any, pictures of paintings in their frames.

I would powerpoint the image in the book, and fade in the image
as seen in the museum.

Point out that there is no serious museum where the art is unframed.
Even the three pieces that I personally know were painted in "gallery wrap"
format by Roy Lichtenstein that hand in the PAM, are framed......
(not to my taste or one that does the art justice - - but framed)

The local booster club may give out certificates that are "suitable for framing,
and noticeably not"..... but the White House and any body presenting something
of value, does so framed nicely.

The fastest way to depreciate your art, you talent and your name - - is to apply
none or cheap frames.

IMHO

I wanna frame this post. Classic.
 
Jeff would you mind posting that letter that you used back in August of 2012 if you don't have time to put together a new list? I am sure many of us would like to see it as well. I know it can be hard to find time to get things put together so please show us the one you currently have on file..

Thanks very much it is always good to see what other framers are using and sharing with their customers.
 
A group of images that illustrate the damage that bad art and framing materials cause is a great starting point.

Hugh

Excellent point, Hugh. I save old damaged mats and take photos of damaged art for educational purposes. A picture gets their attention. I also pass around TruVue demo samples when talking about glass. If the class starts to fade, whip out the scratch test from Tru Vue and you will have the all engaged in no time.

I start my classes with a section on preparation of your art/photo for framing. I cover such topics as print size, signature placement, and so on. We sell ready mades like Jeff R does, so I talk with them about sizing for ready mades, glass upgrades, backing upgrades, matting, and so on. And yes, we do get business from the classes.

This is a very helpful thread.
 
Like Kristie start with visual aid on all the do not's and damage examples..38 years you get to collect a lot of those....

I have been taking my Computer with our Wizard POS and IFVisualization to the group talks. I use a projector and a big screen. When the talk is arranged I tell them to ask members to bring flash drives with their art that they have framed or not framed. Never insult how something has been framed just show how it may present better. I take some of their works and show what it looks like and what it could look like. I point out why I picked the colors and frames. Explaining how each one compliments it in a certain way and that the frame is just the house for the art which is the most important part.
I also include a quip about it really does not matter how much they would pay to buy their art. They are not the buyer. It is how much the buyer feels it is valued. Then I ask if any one knows how much "I" would pay for the art on the screen, My point being they have no idea what I am thinking, so how do they know what the customer they are selling to feels it is worth. If they say they can not get a higher price that would include the price of framing. Reply is then you are in the wrong market or the art is not up to standards to demand a high price.
 
While I agree that it's good to show damage that can occur over time as a result of improper framing, I see this as a negative sell. What could be perceived as scare tactics may turn-off your audience. Instead, I would emphasize the positive aspects of preservation as it relates to present and future value of the art, perception of the artist's view of the value of his/her work, etc. Many artists, and non-artists too, are unable to look that far ahead, or simply don't care about future events. Examples of this near-sightedness abound in society. I would prefer to place emphasis on the benefits to the artist and the increase in sale-ability of their work. A quick glimpse of a cancer-laden lungs is all one really needs.

If you look at advertising from insurance companies such as Allstate, Farmers, etc., they are very careful about not using scare tactics except when wrapped in humor.
 
There are no real secrets to framing... just methods...

Framing.......Revealed to Artists....

This title is in a little spin on what is in a framing package.
 
Here is a completely different kind of question about doing a presentation of this type. The art group is hiring me to do this. In other words, I am being paid.

Do I as a speaker have any rights to tell my audience to turn off their phones for the duration of the presentation? Can people live for thirty-forty minutes without their "media"? Do I have the right to demand their complete attention? I don't want redundant questions from a person who missed a point because they were texting.

It has been a while since I did something like this, and I remember the last time they had a video camera set up which freaked me out a bit (and then caused my vexation when I realized this particular group would never have to hire me again because they could replay the tape).

I have no objections to anyone who would want to take a few shots of my samples after the presentation, but not during.
 
video taping. : just mumble, talk quietly or refer people to the sheets you handed out. Then they will need you there in the future :) Seriously though if you say that techniques and practices are evolving, changing and constantly improving, that what you knew last year has been changed by methods learned this year their tape of you will be "obsolete" next year. In other words, be honest as things do change.

texting : my wife works in the schools. she tells her students to turn off their phones. she has a student that "didn't hear her" tell them to turn them off. Everyday. So she got his number from his contact list and texted him in class. It said "please turn off your phone" :) He got the message and everyone else just laughed at him. Took a difficult situation and made it funny.

See if the group will give you the contact info of the people there and send them all a thank you text when the class starts. It could say "thank you for turning off your phones. I truly think it helped keep distracting interuptions to a minimum. I hope you learned a lot from the meeting, I would be willing to answer any questions you may have now or in the future."

If their phone was off the message will be awaiting them, if it was on they'll get the message in the meeting with everyone else looking at them....
 
Sounds like a great idea, Rick - except I do not have a phone that texts - it only makes phone calls, it is a stupid phone and not a smart phone.

The group is sending out a newsletter with my bio and mayhap I will ask them to be sure to remember to turn off their phones. I guess it depends on the ages of the members of the group. I was somewhere recently with a large group of people and did not see one phone in use. It amazed me. But everyone was over 60....... :icon11:
 
I was having a think about the title of your presentation…

Pointing the name at “artists” I feel is not a great idea … picture framing is for all….

Picture framing is for all regardless of who has to do it….. you don’t want artists thinking that they can frame in a different way from others…

Why not something like ….. “Picture Framing”…..How to!!! …… or something similar… “Picture Framing” ….. “Not just for artists”….. there are many spins you can put on the subject…..

Regarding phones…. Just ask that they are turned off or on silent and to make the point take your own phone out and look as if you are checking it…..

If the organisers have not already told the attendees you may have to do the “housekeeping duty” of pointing out where fire exits are….

You could ask the organisers to send around an attendance list to get signed and to capture contact details …. Names, Email and Telephone numbers only…. It may be a legal requirement to get this list filled, in Ireland you have to sign into meetings to comply with fire regulations…

The best of luck with your presentation, it is a big undertaking, Jean (Siobhan) my wife is at TCD Dublin today giving a talk to a bunch of European politicians, Jean is well used to given talks however for today given the location TCD and its place in Ireland for education and the audience she was quite nervous this morning… about how today would go….

On a side note we had a people (Jack) from Buffalo and his wife to be she is from Austin with us last Saturday….. we took them on a tour of the Dublin, Wicklow and Kildare areas Ireland…… unfortunately Buffalo is losing him as he is relocating to Austin by July 4th….. he challenged my mind fantastically with the questions he could ask about all sorts of things we were discussing and seeing….
 
Here is a completely different kind of question about doing a presentation of this type. The art group is hiring me to do this. In other words, I am being paid.

Do I as a speaker have any rights to tell my audience to turn off their phones for the duration of the presentation?.

Yes you have the right and you also have the obligation.

You are the professional, and you are being paid to try to impart knowledge; you need to help by trying to eliminate distractions by politely asking participants to turn off their cell phones, and making sure you turn yours off too.

This is done at the classes at WCAF, and at most PPFA training.

The exception might be if they were trying to use Skype or some such method to allow non-present members to listen in, but they should let you know ahead of time if they were going to do that.

Good luck.
 
It is not only common to request that cellphones be powered off, it's also a courtesy the audience.

No recording devices. Your show, your rules. BTW, if the camera is in the back of the room, or even the front in most cases, the sound quality will be so poor that the video will be unwatchable regardless.

EDIT: Russ just beat me to it.
 
Even if you weren't being paid, you have a right to ask. Your time is still worth something. Especially if you have to close your store during those hours.
 
Do I as a speaker have any rights to tell my audience to turn off their phones for the duration of the presentation? Can people live for thirty-forty minutes without their "media"? Do I have the right to demand their complete attention? I don't want redundant questions from a person who missed a point because they were texting.

As a courtesy to all participants tonight, please turn off all cell phones or put them on silent mode. I understand you may receive an important call, but please step outside to take it if you need to.
 
Dermot - it is an art group. Therefore I can safely assume all are artists or artists and I am safe in calling them artists.

I like the idea of turning off my own phone, but it will have to be a pantomime because I never turn it on unless I am making or expecting a call. LOL. And nowadays I would be embarrassed to show it to anyone; even though it is red, it is still a flip phone....... :icon19:
 
As a courtesy to all participants tonight, please turn off all cell phones or put them on silent mode. I understand you may receive an important call, but please step outside to take it if you need to.

Oops, I think this may have been taken the wrong way. I meant it as a suggestion as to what to say to encourage everyone to mute their phones.
 
It's certainly a great conversation starter.
 
Oh, I am so excited. I was digging through my sample collection for appropriate specimens to show the art group.

Hit the jackpot! Several yards of nice formerly white "artist tape" which I pulled off some art a couple years back and saved on mylar strips.

The stuff is so yellow on the back it would curl your hair!!!

Bwahahahaha!
 
Framing presentations

I've done hundreds of slide shows in the past on natural history subjects so when we took over this shop three years ago I was happy to do some about framing. I vary it depending on the audience and usually call it "What's in a Frame?" My emphasis is on giving people information so they can make better decisions - like what conservation framing is and why it is more expensive. I also include some of the tips offered in this thread - surprised to see so many about location of signatures! And I have started another campaign: I encourage artists to put on their price tags or labels if a piece is "custom framed" or "conservation framed", and if not to put something like "standard framing." That lets them explain part of the "high" price of the art as cost of framing, why their piece might be more than the one next to it (in the big-box frame) and also opens the door to an explanation if a prospective buyer asks about it. I don't know how galleries would react. Any thoughts on this from those of you with more experience?
 
I want to do a demo of how to attach a dust cover, because that always seems to baffle artists. In my experience it seems that they think the paper should be cut to size before attaching. So I want to teach them a few methods of cutting off the excess after attachment.

BUT...

That presupposes their artwork is already fastened into their wooden frames. So I suppose I have to show the that, too. I use a variety of guns, like my F-18 brad gun, my Fletcher flexible point driver or my Red Devil point driver. Chances are, not many artists have any of these guns. Should I show the how to insert brads with a tack hammer or those awful little footed diamond points?

Which method do you show to artists if you do this finishing demo?
 
I want to do a demo of how to attach a dust cover, because that always seems to baffle artists. In my experience it seems that they think the paper should be cut to size before attaching. So I want to teach them a few methods of cutting off the excess after attachment.

BUT...

That presupposes their artwork is already fastened into their wooden frames. So I suppose I have to show the that, too. I use a variety of guns, like my F-18 brad gun, my Fletcher flexible point driver or my Red Devil point driver. Chances are, not many artists have any of these guns. Should I show the how to insert brads with a tack hammer or those awful little footed diamond points?

Which method do you show to artists if you do this finishing demo?

Use your Red Devil. Let them know there are proper tools out there.
 
F18! Where do you get the points for that! Mine ist kaput so no longer need points. It lost it's oomph.

But this speak of tools has me baffled. Do you not use duct tape? Have you stopped using packing tape? Why must the artwork be held in securely with points?

If you showed the artists the different ways that frames have come into your shop, with the hodge podged attachment systems do you think the artists would get the idea or get offended?
 
I have a lifetime supply of brads for the F18 (thanks to the framer down the street who gifted me with his last 2 huge boxes of the which he no longer needed once he upgraded to a powered gun).

I have decided to skip the fitting part of the demo. But I do plan on doing a demo of making corner pockets for mounting paper art. Tape? Hinges? Not gonna go there! Tape is for booking - that is all!

I have distilled 44 years into 3 pages of ranting/pleading/tips/guidelines and suggestions. They will go home with copies of these gems. Lucky sods.
 
I have a lifetime supply of brads for the F18 (thanks to the framer down the street who gifted me with his last 2 huge boxes of the which he no longer needed once he upgraded to a powered gun).

I have decided to skip the fitting part of the demo. But I do plan on doing a demo of making corner pockets for mounting paper art. Tape? Hinges? Not gonna go there! Tape is for booking - that is all!

I have distilled 44 years into 3 pages of ranting/pleading/tips/guidelines and suggestions. They will go home with copies of these gems. Lucky sods.



How do we get copies of your 44 years in 3 pages?:shrug::shrug:
 
LOL, Russ. My three pages would be nothing new to anyone who has been framing for at least a decade or more.

Once I finalize the thing (I am editing every five minutes) - I will make it into a pdf in case anyone thinks it will be of value.

I lifted a couple of Ellen's ideas from this thread and I also added a quote from Bron. So it is a group effort.

:)
 
My presentation went very well last night (aside from the fact that they forgot to assign someone to bring the eats so there were NO SNACKS!).

I showed them samples of what happens to their nice white "artist's tape" (turns yellow on artwork), what not to use for wire (like twist-ties), why wide mats bring out the art (showed them a postage stamp in the triple mat in an 8 x 10).

But the one thing that I hope they will remember is this: At the start of my talk I passed out a little plastic container with two things in it, strips of paper, 1" x 2" and paperclips. I told them to take one of each of these items.

After I talked about how bad tape can be when it is placed on artwork, I told them to get out their little pieces of paper. I told them I was about to reveal a secret that would change their lives!

I showed them how to fold a corner pocket. And glue it to the backing board with white glue (Elmer's, gel medium, mod podge, etc). Then I showed them how to scale a corner pocket for large or small, thick or thin - and how to use up their scraps of drawing paper!

I am sure at least now they will be doing far less damage to their artwork, and maybe, just maybe, for this small group of 30 artists, I will not have to cringe and tear out my hair and come here and rant when one of their customers comes to me for a frame.
 
Well done, Mar!
 
Sounds like it went well Mar. Did you have that list to give them that Jeff promised to send to you? Bet that list will help out with future frame jobs :) It's nice when we an give the participants a handy thing to take home with them.
 
Never sent it Bob since it would be bad business for Mar to offer a way they can create artwork that fits perfectly into ready made frames. If Mar offered a large selection of ready made frames it would be helpful but otherwise it would drive business to the BB or internet sellers.
 
Just thought it would have been nice to be able to give artists something handy. The mats included in a readymade would not work so they would have to come to her to get mats cut :) I am assuming the list was something like 11 by 14 with 2 inch mats with 1/8 overlap image size should be masked at 7 1/4 by 11 1/4. with 1 1/2 inch mats and 1/8 overlap the image should be masked off at 8 1/4 by 12 1/4.
 
I decided against getting into the whole "readymade" standard size thing with them - no one asked, either.

I have made my three pages of "Suggestions for Artists" into a pdf so if anyone would like a copy (or offers a trade, as Kirstie did) - PM me your email address.
 
I haven't done a demonstration in a long time. Last one I did involved wearing fancy bracelets and riding in the backseat of a cop car :) OK, I have done some framing demonstrations since then. Mainly I had a frame cross section I made showing the multiple layers of a framed job.
 
The three pages I handed out to them were pretty much along the lines of what I said to them in the talk: Save your artwork for the benefit of your great great grandchildren. Spare them the shame and horror of discovering that if only Great Grandma had not used self adhesive linen tape (acid free!) all over the face of her watercolors they would be worth ten times more! LOL

I am not foolish enough to think anyone of these people is going to come to me for their framing.

At this point I am just getting danged sick and tired of seeing blue painters' tape on the front of nice watercolors. :nuts:

I just want to save as much art as I can. :thumbsup:
 
It's not just the up-and-comers that need a bit of guidance. A gallery-owner customer of mine has just had a big exhibition for a quite famous and very talented artist. He brought me one of the pictures he sold because he noticed a queer bump in the corner of a canvas. He didn't want to let it go to the buyer in that state. On closer inspection I found that there was actually a chunk missing off the stretcher bar. And when I got the canvas off the stretcher all the bars were mismatched. Different profiles. I suppose some artists think all stretcher bars are a intermixable.
This artist sells his stuff for ££££££s. A matched set of bars for the canvas would have cost maybe £5. I'm all for being frugal, but that was definitely case of spoiling the ship for a hap'eth of tar.
 
Mar, congratulations on your great talk. After your success, can we anticipate you now talking at the WCAF in January?

I'll PM you my email address. Also I will conger up some notes for you on something, probably something about decorative mats, if that is okay. It will probably be a while as I'm coming into a busy period. (No, not framing, Janet is Gardening and she has me do things in the yard.)

I will use your notes to help me in the fall; an artists group wants me to talk in the fall as they take off during the summer, but they may forget by then.
 
Bumps in the corners of the canvas reminds me of the time I looked at suspicious bulges under the canvas and after investigating, found all the keys stuffed in there. Apparently the artist had heard that you are supposed to force the keys into the corners..... :nuts:
 
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