Dear Paul, I knew that your project was not going to fly. I am not happy nor sad for having been right as I had noting at stake in this case. It's true that when major players (manufacturers, trade press, PPFA, even some old TG heavy weight characters) get involved in a project things start moving and take shape. I bet that all minor or major manufacturers/suppliers, trade press, PPFA and TG influent people had heard and pondered your proposals. At least some of the above players would have come to help you, adopt or even steal your idea if it only was viable and didn't go against the future progress of this industry as in fact it did. You may not yet be ready to admit of this but, as cynical as it may sound, the major players that you invoked are not necessarily interested in saving one individual framer or the other, or help indies survive in their struggle with the BBs or any other real or imaginary competition/menace of theirs for that matter. Don't expect them to come in front of the class and admit "yeap, Cornel is right", because they won't. But if you objectively analyze the picture you must agree that their game is much larger than that of caring for indies and, that their game's name is promote, build and defend the future of the industry as a whole. Helping indies, which are a diminishing, slowly drying out branch of this industry, resist and regain prominence in face of BBs or any other dynamic, up coming framing structure of the future is unrealistic, just like betting on sick and ailing instead of young, strong and powerful people would be. Like it or not (and I too have a list of facts that I detest about the future myself), what goes on in this industry is called "progress", and that’s the main road to the future. Independent framers need to adjust and slide on top of this implacable tide or be pulled under. Your plan was trying not only to stop the process, but to reverse it, and that made it into an amateurish, utopian, senseless and unsustainable proposal. You thought that I was opposing you or the other Paul? Wrong, for me there is no flesh, bone and sole beyond those avatars around here, but ideas. I usually don't second ideas that I agree with, but I do engage those that I don't understand or think to be dead wrong. I had no faith in your project, although I wish someone could reverse the trend and bring back the old good times and their people too. I don't try to beat my drums, and pretend that I was smart, for in reality I wasn't more than using common sense just like the (silent) majority that I sided with. You really had very-very few followers but, your project stirred controversy and (my all time #1 be hated) gratuitous compliments, which you and JPaul misinterpreted for enthusiastic support (and wishful snow ball effect).