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TruVue Conservation Reflection Control Glass

Discussion in 'The Grumble' started by Greg Gomon, May 31, 2007.

  1. JRB

    JRB PFG, Picture Framing God

    Before the Internet and forums such as this existed, every company, no matter how large or small, treated every complainer the same. The response was always: " You are the ONLY person who has ever complained about our product/service." As long as I can remember this has been the standard response to problems.

    Since the Internet has become so popular with us groveling masses, most companies have adopted other methods of responding, like telling the complainer how important their feedback is to them and the matter will be throughly investigated etc., etc. This is to stop us from slamming them on public forums and such.

    All that said, there must be other suppliers of non glare glass, the stuff has been around for a very long time, way before TruVu came along.

    Myself, I use the heck out of their conservation clear, and I find it an excellent product.

    I don't much care for their Museum glass at all. The stuff is just to darn sensitive to work with. I priced it down at Aaron Brothers a few weeks back and they are retailing it at just a few bucks more than what I can buy it wholesale for. Cutting, cleaning, dodging the flaws, and just handling the stuff, is just too darn time consuming, and expensive.

    I know for a fact I have spent more than twice what I have taken in from customers on the stuff, it just ain't worth it for a small volume retailer. If I could buy it at Aaron Brothers prices, perhaps I would feel different, but for now, no way.

    I do not push it or display it any longer. If a customer asks for it, I will sell it to them, under protest.

    John
     
  2. Mike Labbe

    Mike Labbe Member, Former moderator team volunteer

    We LOVE Museum and CC is our default glazing, but we don't normally carry the CRC product. In over 5 years, we only sold it on one piece. I'm not a fan of the RC product either, because of the image distortion it's design produces. Museum does it all with class and seems to enhance the colors in the art.

    TV is a very reasonable and responsible company (I'd put them in the top 2 for customer service and for their efforts to better the industry), and I bet they would be happy to hear constructive feedback.

    My question: Have you brought this concern up with your Tru-Vue REP, if you have one? It might be a good idea, and thats why they exist. (or email/call)

    If the product is defective, i'm sure that they will take it back and want to know about it.

    Best regards,
    Mike Labbe, Get The Picture
    co-moderator
     
  3. Jerry Ervin

    Jerry Ervin PFG, Picture Framing God


    Do they really have those?

    Does anyone know who the person is for North Carolina?
     
  4. Bluewing

    Bluewing True Grumbler

    Letter To Tru Vue President

    I would like to have all of us put our names on a letter address it and mail it certified to the president of tru vue and let them know just how bad this glass is and what it is going to cost them. Someone on a 800 help line is just not sufficient enough to get my point across. Any takers??
     
  5. Bluewing

    Bluewing True Grumbler

    Tru Vue President

    Jane Boyce (President)

    TRU VUE(R), INC.

    9400 W. 55th St., McCook, IL 60525-3636
     
  6. Kirstie

    Kirstie PFG, Picture Framing God

    Rep? What rep? We buy TV from LJ and have never seen a TV rep in 30 years. We sell Museum and CC. CC is the default glass at our shop, but we encourage Museum. And we charge for it accordingly. Delicate? Yes, but less so than the previous Denglas product. Our customers love it once they have used it once.

    We don't really sell non glare products, except for acrylic and usually for corporate where they often have huge windows which require some glare control. The acrylic has a finer etch anyway, much nicer product than the glass. NG film? Yuk. I'm sure they wil get an ear full at the next major show.

    Do we have an e-mail for the TV president?
     
  7. Doug Gemmell

    Doug Gemmell SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    Try yelling

    HEY JANE, YOU PUT THE COATING ON THE WRONG SIDE!
     
  8. Doug Gemmell

    Doug Gemmell SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    Another Approach

    Bluewing, just in case yelling didn't work, you can add my name to your letter.
     
  9. piley

    piley Grumbler

    UV coated glass

    Seeking every framers dream of more personal time, I sold my very successful (15 years) shop three years ago and moved aboard to cruise my boat full time. I do miss the job satisfactiion and challenges. Most of all, I miss the interaction with my many loyal, repeat customers. So, to keep current, I enjoy frequent Grumble visits.

    I would like to share my experience with coated glass.

    Over the years Tru-Vue UV clear glass quality declined to a point where there were more sheets with inclusions, scratches and film defects per case than usable product.

    Framers Market, CT offered an introductory price on a new product called
    Inspiration, UV Clear Glass made by Guardian Industries.

    Tried it, liked it and eventually began exclusively using this superior product, phasing out all Tru-Vue frustratin. No more paper inter leaf as each sheet of the Guardian product had a peel off PROTECTIVE BLUE film on the UV coated side.

    Manufacturer recommended cutting on the blue peel off side but I found cutting on the outside surface best for me and then using a blade to cleanly sever the blue protective film. A quick brush of the edges eliminated all of those sometime tenacioius micro chips. Then, spraying and wiping the outside surface, brush again, inspect, peel blue film away and set on the already dusted mat package.

    Cutting and cleaning Tru-Vue glass only to find a hidden defect was no more! NIMS, Not In My Shop!

    I could not give this time saving, frustration free NEW product more praise.

    Why am I not seeing this product mentioned? Is it still being made?
    Did problems develop?
     
  10. Richard Darling

    Richard Darling SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    I looked up the guardian website and Inspiration glass still appears to be available. Unfortunately the interactive map of distributors page couldn't be found. I sent them an email for more information.

    Looks like it could be an interesting alternative. The idea of having film on the coated side is quite attractive. No more time spent having to wrap scrap pieces.

    Piley, do you remember what it cost compared to Tru Vue?
     
  11. Pat Murphey

    Pat Murphey SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    While I understand the complaints here about TruVue's new conservation reflection control, I have to speak up about complaints about their other products. I can count on one hand the number of flaws I have found in conservation clear and clear in my 11 years in business. IMHO the complaints are exaggerated. As to Museum Glass, yes it is more vulnerable to scratching, but those who stay away from it are throwing away thousands of dollars in additional profit. Except for some regulars who demand it all the time, most Museum Glass sales for me are add-ons after the customer has agreed to a design, resulting in bonus profit on maybe 25% of sales.
     
  12. osgood

    osgood SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    A couple of years ago I tried a couple of batches and sent most of it back. The chunks of "stuff" in the coating made most of it unuseable.

    I have been too frightened to try it again!
     
  13. Framar

    Framar SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    Piley - for a while Crescent sold what they called "Artglass" which had this blue plastic film on it that peeled off easily after cutting (so scrap was at all times fully protected - or you could cut lites to size and send out for a logo to be etched without worrying about the optical coating getting ruined).

    Anyhoo - Crescent made a deal with TruView (who was at that time selling matboard?) that neither would again step away from their main product line - ie, Matboard for Crescent and Glass for TV - and therefore the lovely blue-jacketed glass did thus disappear from our shelves and our shops. Someone correct me if I am remembering this scenario incorrectly.

    Maybe this Artglass was made by Guardian??? That name does sound familiar......

    I really liked that Artglass.

    *sigh*
     
  14. JRB

    JRB PFG, Picture Framing God

    TruVue conservation clear has pretty much become our default glass, I don't think I have sold regular plain old glass to a customer in months. I find it easy to handle and very profitable.

    I do not understand how anyone can find their museum glass profitable at all, unless they are ignoring the flaws and just letting their customers have whatever comes out. My last sale of museum glass was about a month ago. It was for a 20"X32" piece. I had one lite of 24"X36" in stock. When it came time to do the project, that piece had way too many flaws to get my size. I ordered another 3 pack carton. I could only find one piece that was flaw free. It took a total of four sheets of 24"X36" to get my one piece. I told my supplier about it, and they called TruVue who pretty much told them, tough luck.

    I sold it at $60.00 per square foot. Somehow, I don't know what it is, but I seem to be having a really tough time trying to figure out how TruVue museum glass can possibly be considered a profitable item. The only way I can figure it is to give my customers flawed pieces, I think I'll leave that to someone else, don't want to do that in my shop.

    As far as their non glare glass is concerned, I will look for another supplier or I will only offer the acrylic version.

    John
     
  15. HB

    HB SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    John

    I don't know what you are talking about - what kind of flaws? Are you cleaning it right - I think you are leaving all kinds of money on the table AND shortcoming your customers! Honest.
     
  16. Mike Labbe

    Mike Labbe Member, Former moderator team volunteer

    We had a piece come back last week with MANY spots on it, but it was because the customer was using the wrong type of glass cleaner. We provided them with another small bottle of the TV purple cleaner, and all is well. (we buy it by the gallon and put it in very small spray bottles, included when we sell the glazing) The empty bottles come from Wal-mart, in the "Travel Size products" aisle. We label them with our company logo on a foil label, and the museum care label.

    It sounds like your supplier had a bad batch or something. I dont think we have EVER had a single flaw on museum, and we sell a bunch of it. It's a very profitable product that sells itself, just from the sample piece comparing it to CC on the front counter. I cant tell you how many times customers have asked for it just based on that side by side comparison.

    I encourage ya to give it another chance. It's good stuff!

    Mike
     
  17. piley

    piley Grumbler

    UV Glass Quality Problems

    I've inquired of Guardian Industries sales manager, 800-521-9040 and to my dismay learned that they no longer distribute their 'Inspiration' UV glass to the picture framing industry.

    According to Guardian, they were not able to sign on enough distributors to continue the picture glass product line. It was a corporate decision and their efforts now serve the commercial window industry.

    Sad, as they produced a superior product whose peel off blue plastic was, unlike sheet acrylic, never a static charge problem. It totally protected left over pieces in storage.

    Truth is, big distributors always win in the end unless we framers work together, using our purchasing power, to insist on higher quality standards.
     
  18. Twin2

    Twin2 SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    I had purchased a 32x40 case of clear UV glass while I was living in Calgary, not too long before I moved back to N.S. It was listed in my catalogue as "Guardian Inspiration UV Clear", however, the label on the box said "Artist's Choice", so I'm not 100% sure it is the same product. It had the blue peel-off coating, though.

    I did NOT like that glass at all. Of all the pieces I tried using out of that case, there were numerous flaws - a lot of fine 'pits' in the glass; and totally unusable IMHO :fire:. It could be that I had received a bad batch of glass, but I hadn't used it until after I moved to N.S., so it was too late to return it. I switched over to Tru Vue's conservation clear glass after that and still have a couple lites left of the Artist's Choice. One of these days, I'll have to take a closer look to see if any can be used.

    My local distributor in N.S. had some cases of the Artist's Choice UV glass on a clearout special last year, but I passed on the offer after the frustrations I had experienced.
     
  19. Pat Murphey

    Pat Murphey SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    Piley,

    I don't think Guardian is hurting in the picture framing glass arena. Where do you think that TruVue is getting the the glass that they sell us - coated and packaged?
     
  20. Lance E

    Lance E Member

    I understand that the "etched" surfaces of the glass was done with Acid - perhaps this is the environmental factor that has lead to the demise of the product?

    Wouldn't it be great if TV could balance it's coporate social responsibility with a touch of marketing elegance...
     
  21. piley

    piley Grumbler

    Pat,

    I assume you are saying that the Tru-Vue packaged glass is made by Guardian.

    That's understandable but would you also say that the UV clear you are getting has a plastic film or spray on coating? Are they using the same old brown paper separators in lieu of peel off blue protective film?
     
  22. Rick Granick

    Rick Granick SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    John- if you are selling much Museum glass and getting $60 a square foot, I must be leaving a lot of money on the table.
    :icon9: Rick
     
  23. Greg Gomon

    Greg Gomon CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2

    Looks like this thread is getting some interesting feedback from fellow framers. I still seem baffled that no-one from TruVue is interested in our comments. Next, I will check the PPFA chatroom to see if there is a similar thread. I really think "we" need to make a stink about this.

    From my personal perspective, to imply Museum Glass is somehow a viable "alternative" to CRC Glass is absurd. No doubt, the look is superb and the countertop displays set it off well. However, the cost still puts it out of range with 90% of our market. How do I know this figure to be accurate? Because our sales of Museum Glass represent 2% of our total glass sales. How does this compare with the industry? Perhaps someone from TruVue can tell us the percentage of their total gross sales is from the sales of Museum Glass. I would bet it is a tiny number.

    Don't misinterpret my direction here. I love Museum Glass! True, it is harder to clean. But, our customers know it is a "Premium Glass" and accept those issues. CRC is not a "premium glass" and therefore will not accept the fact it scratches easily when cleaning. I cannot accept the problems with this glass. Conclude, it is unrealistic to think Museum Glass and CRC Glass are somehow substitutions for each other. They are not and cannot be direct substitutes. Museum Glass is not an economical alternative.

    Regarding CRC Glass. Our sales of CRC glass represent 20% of our glass sales. Museum Glass is not an economical alternative for those customers.
     
  24. Bluewing

    Bluewing True Grumbler

    President of Tru Vue

    I left a message on Jane Boyces voice mail today for her to call me back tuesday. It will be interesting to see if she calls me back. I am not satisfied with just having a 800 rep take my complaint and hope that something can be done. This really affects my business. I had my LJ rep lookup our glass purchases and she was suprised on how much crc we sell. and past records of crc purchased. It will defintely affect Tru Vue bottom line.

    Greg and Framer Phil are making very valid points. Tru Vue needs to fix this before another company jumps in and addresses this. I have located another company that claims they have non glare glass. I will contact them and see what they have to say. I am not holding my breath at this point. I truly hope that tru vue sees the error of their ways and fixes this. I have been satisfied (with a couple of issues on museum glass) with tru vue as most of you from reading the comments.

    But just posting on this blog is not enough they need to be called, emailed, letters written, so they get the point.

    I will advise on the phone conversation I hope to have with the president of tru vue.
     
  25. Jerry Ervin

    Jerry Ervin PFG, Picture Framing God

    Bluewing

    You will not have any problem finding a replacement for RC (reflection control) glass. Most all glass distributors have some type of the product.

    The problem you will run across is, none of them have UV protection.

    Two of the most successful framers I have ever met do not offer any glass other than plain old glass or RC. Neither of these shops sale UV protective glass at all. I am about this ] [ close to doing likewise.
     
  26. Bluewing

    Bluewing True Grumbler

    Tru Vue President

    Well Jane Boyce contacted me and I am encouraged by the conversation that she and I had. They are aware of the situation(s) and are quite concerned by the feedback they have been getting. She did mention the grumble as well. So it would appear that they are taking this very serious. I am thankful that she took the time to call and I expressed to her my concerns as well as some of the comments expressed on here. I will be communicating with her later this week after getting new glass to see if it was a bad lot or batch. I will advise on my results.

    I would like any who is interested in sharing their concerns to email me directly so that I may pass this information on to her. I hope that people will do this so we can start working on a solution.

    al@bluewinggallery.com
     
  27. stud d

    stud d SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    Bluewing like I said several posts ago...they know. They have known about this thread as soon as it started. They are the major player in the glass business for our industry. They all listen even though they may not respond in a public forum.

    PL
     
  28. JRB

    JRB PFG, Picture Framing God

    Rick, figure out the price of a 20"X32" at $60.00 a square foot. Now figure out the wholesale price of four sheets of 24"X36". Then figure in all the time I spent trying to get my one piece, cutting, cleaning, on the phone, etc. Now splain to me how I made any money?

    John
     
  29. Pat Murphey

    Pat Murphey SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    John,

    I pay less than $8.50 a square foot for Museum Glass, rarely have to clean anything other than maybe one fingerprint. That 20 x 32 is half of a 40 x 32 light that costs just over $70. I have no problem selling that $35 light for approx. $100 - and I expend LESS labor installing that light in a frame. That "reasonable" pricing yields good volume and lots of profit in Museum Glass sales.
     
  30. JRB

    JRB PFG, Picture Framing God

    Pat, you are on the east coast, where the stuff is made, less shipping distance, less cost. If you pay slightly less than $8.50 a square foot, you should be retailing it for a minimum of $50.00 a square foot. Unless you have absolutely no waste, your losing money if you sell for less. Remember, after you pay all your bills and taxes, and yourself, you should have a positive number on your balance sheet. That positive balance should be every month, not just some of them. If you are not a store front operation, I guess you could pull it off, depending on the price you retail it for.

    I do appreciate your response though and I know for a fact your one of the good guys. Airplanes and dogs, heck, what's not to like?

    John
     
  31. Bluewing

    Bluewing True Grumbler

    Listening and Doing Something

    Thanks Patrick I believed you in them listening. What I am trying to accomplish is getting results to my (our) problem. This forum is doing what I consider a good job of informing me that I am not alone on my concerns. Having taken then next step to addressing this directly to the company was my way of trying to get answers. For our company it is a matter of urgency due to the volume of crc that we sell. I will inform everyone of what I learn.
     
  32. Pat Murphey

    Pat Murphey SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    John,

    LJ's Museum glass price is the same nationwide, with free (no addn'l) cost delivery - and I do enough business (a good deal of the $ for said glass) with them to qualify for 5 box pricing for single boxes. I keep just enough in stock at any given time. I have said this over and over again my pricing yields higher volume, AND, since most Museum Glass sales are added after the customer has agreed to design and price (with CC) my markup yields thousands of dollars additional profit to my one man shop's bottom line. The huge increase in Museum Glass sales came AFTER I was able to reduce prices with TV's 35% reduction in wholesale several years ago. I also periodically experiment with quoting higher prices which usually lead to a no thanks (that I can sometimes salvage by giving a "try it" discount). I have a hard time understanding throwing away these extra substantial profits with this product because of an adherence to COG percentages in all circumstances. I sell closed corner frames, too, because I am willing to sell them in the 2 - 2.5 markup range.

    :D Your business is yours to operate as you see fit - but don't close your mind to other strategies.

    Airplanes and cats, John - I hope that's still OK.
     
  33. JRB

    JRB PFG, Picture Framing God

    Pat, Sorry for confusing your cat with a dog. I have three cats, you'd think I would know better. At least I got the airplane right. I have a great lovable twenty pound shop cat. She has a bigger following than me, the whole neighborhood knows her by name and she gets at least five or more visits a day, from little kids to old men and women. I think it's kind of a therapeutic thing for a lot of people, they need their fuzzy animal fix. I know it puts a smile on their faces and "Bucket" is a real ham, she talks to them, rolls over on her back for tummy rubs, little children try and pick her up, she is great. Her picture is in all our advertising.

    I have tried the lower pricing thing in the past, the increased volume that I have gotten never increased enough to make it profitable. If it's working for you, my hat is off & I congratulate you, it's hard to do, especially in a small operation.

    I think someone told me that you are a retired ATP. I just started in the last few years. I have a little warrior & am having a heck of a lot of fun, nothing remotely close to your achievements though.

    John
     
  34. Pat Murphey

    Pat Murphey SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    John,

    I started in 1964 by buying a commercial and instrument course in Piper Colts at a 2000' grass strip in SE PA. The $2,500 tab - the price of a new car that a 21 year-old would want then - was the best investment that I ever made. A year and a half later a company (TWA), that believed that young motivated flight instructors would make good employees, hired me. It was a wonderful ride.

    Good luck with your flying.

    BTW, I was only trying to encourage you to try Museum Glass from a different perspective on how it fits into a framing business - an opportunity for profit that does not detract from already "made" sales.
     
  35. JRB

    JRB PFG, Picture Framing God

    Pat, in 1964 I went to MYF to check out learning to fly, I had my young wife with me. They showed me around, let me sit in a Cherokee and told me what it would cost. It was way beyond my means at the time, with a wife and kid. It was at an accredited flight school at Gibbs. The only thing they did not mention was that the Government would have paid for all my training on my GI bill. You would never believe what I have spent since I started, long, long, story. It doesn't matter though, I am enjoying it and that makes it well worth it, to me.

    I appreciate your input on museum glass, however, at this point, it isn't for my shop. Like I said, if they ask, they can have it, I just don't push it.

    John
     
  36. Maryann

    Maryann SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    the saga continues

    Today I opened a new box of 22 X 28 CRC (with green tape). It was only reflection control to 1/2" of the edge, then it was clear. Tru Vue was quick to issue a credit but I's rather not have to take the time to deal with these problems. Time = $$ and I thought of just using the next size and cutting it down but thought TV should be aware.
     
  37. TGFU

    TGFU CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2

    Does anyone have an update on this issue, or have you heard anything new from TV? Do you know if any suppliers still have the red tape (old stuff) on their shelf?

    I would like to stop offering CRC and offer CRC Acrylite instead, but the cost is about double.
     
  38. Carol A. Johanningsmeier

    Carol A. Johanningsmeier CGF, Certified Grumble Framer

    When I called Larson Juhl to place my order, they told me about the sale or CRC. I asked if the tape was red or green and they did not know. So I passed on the sale. I am no longer offering it. I have only had one customer who requested it and when they come in again I will deal with the issue at that time. I have not heard any news from TV.
     
  39. Jerry Ervin

    Jerry Ervin PFG, Picture Framing God

    I got my first 2 boxes of the new stuff Tuesday. I have not had to open either yet but I will soon.

    I thought that I would actually try some before I passed judgment on the product.
     
  40. Emibub

    Emibub PFG, Picture Framing God

    I wanted to use it before complainng too. I honestly did not have a problem with flaws and I looked closely. My biggest problem was just handling it. I had to constantly remind myself to be careful since the side that damages easily is on the outside now. My usual routine is to wear gloves to cut it and place it on the art so I don't have to clean it. Once the glass is in place with the art I don't have to worry about scratching any longer. Not so with the new stuff, I had to be constantly aware that I had the fragile side exposed. I did not care for that at all. I'll continue to use it warily, but I will suggest UVRC first.
     
  41. Jerry Ervin

    Jerry Ervin PFG, Picture Framing God


    Wouldn't that be just like Museum?

    It damages easily on the outside as well.

    I think that I'll go open one of those boxes just to get a look at it.
     
  42. TGFU

    TGFU CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2

    Jerry, Let us know what you find.

    Thanks!!
     
  43. Maryann

    Maryann SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer


    I know they promised to send a credit for the defective box that I had and they have not followed through.

    Not very happy with TruVue right now.
     
  44. Jim Miller

    Jim Miller SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God

    If Tru Vue is to send you a credit, that would be extremely unusual. With few exceptions, the manufacturer sells through a well developed network of distributors. One general rule is that their distributors provide replacements for the defective Tru Vue products they sell. And when a credit is due, it should come from the company that sold you the defective glass and replaced it.

    By the normal course of events, your credit would come from the distributor, not the manufacturer. Assuming that is the case, I suggest you follow up with that distributor and make sure you get the credit owed. And if that distributor does not come through, then you should contact Tru Vue with a complaint about that distributor falling short of expectations.

    My guess is your unhappiness with the manufacturer is misplaced. If your credit does not come as promised, shouldn't your unhappiness be directed toward the distributor?
     
  45. Emibub

    Emibub PFG, Picture Framing God


    Yeah, just like Museum Jerry, only I am not used to having to think about it with conservation glass. It feels awkward putting it on the cutter backwards. In fact, if I hadn't read this thread I would not have known of the change, they should have included something indicating the new procedure.
     
  46. Terry Scidmore CPF

    Terry Scidmore CPF MGF, Master Grumble Framer

    Just finished a picture a customer brought in this afternoon. He had it framed somewhere else within the last couple of weeks, and discovered some spelling errors in the copy that he had supplied. He stopped here with the corrected copy and asked if I could swap things out, rather than make a trip back to the original framer.

    When I tried cleaning the nonglare glass, his fingerprints on the glass were hard to remove. It is TVCRC, and it must be the new stuff, because it looks a little different from the "old" TVCRC that I still have on hand. I haven't had problems removing customers fingerprints from the old CRC, and I do think that the new finish is "different" looking - kind of streaky/blurry at some angles.

    Alcohol was the thing that removed his fingerprints.

    When I finished, the customer promptly pulled out his keys and started pointing to the errors he had corrected in the copy, tapping the glass with the keys over each error. Then there goes his finger on the glass again!

    A quick explanation about not tapping the glass with his keys, and the problem with the fingerprints, and he is out the door. Hope he doesn't stop at McDonalds on the way home and smear burger and french fry grease all over the glass!
     
  47. Jerry Ervin

    Jerry Ervin PFG, Picture Framing God

    I have used it on three jobs now, and I hate to say that I don't see why everyone is belly aching. The finished pieces look the same as they did before. I guess that is good or bad depending on how you feel about the product.

    Having a film on the outside is no different that Museum or AR.

    I will keep using it for now because it is around 30% of my glass sales.

    I do feel that with a streamlined process the price should drop some for the product. Notice I said should.

    I endeavor to remain cautiously optimistic.
     
  48. Terry Scidmore CPF

    Terry Scidmore CPF MGF, Master Grumble Framer

    Jerry, I wasn't "belly aching".

    Just as you posted earlier, I wanted to try the product before I put in my 2 cents.

    IMHO, I posted what I thought after using it, in comparison to my experience with using the product for a number of years before reformulation.

    While my one time use does not compare to your three time use, I didn't say that the product was horrible and that I would never use it.

    I thought it was kinda comical that the customer kept putting fingerprints on the glass after I worked to get them off and to get the streaks out of the finish.
     
  49. Maryann

    Maryann SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

    !

    I don't know Jim, perhaps I misunderstood. I called Tru Vue directly to let them know of the problem with the etching/coating only being partially applied and my displeasure with the new glass. This wasn't really a problem with the 'new' glass but a defective box of glass. They asked who my distributor was and said they would issue a credit. That was the last that I heard. I guess I need to call my distributor and inquire.

    On another note, I'll email you later about the roadtrip when I figure out when we'll be in your neck of the woods.
     
  50. Jerry Ervin

    Jerry Ervin PFG, Picture Framing God

    My comments were not aimed at you Terry.

    This is long thread full of 'how dare they' and 'I'll never agains'.

    I bet that same customer would have treated any glass product the same way.
     
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