persistent requests for "ballpark" estimates

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Excellent way to handle it, Lance. That's pretty much our approach too. Folks just want a general number so they can see if they are "in the ballpark" with the cost. How we respond to their request gives them a clue as to how they will be treated if they grace us with their business.
:cool: Rick

Quoting from the first response to this thread:
I just had a VERY attractive woman leave here that told me she is gong to be a grandma.
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My wife is very attractive, and she is a grandma.
 
Originally posted by Terry Hart cpf:
Hey Ken, I just got back from being called up front. A week ago a lady was in & I gave her a ballpark on a plain mirror in a readymade for under $200. She just ordered two, custom, @ $550 ea. Got a deposit too.
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Ahhhhh, so that's where they're going after they leave here:)

Congrats!
 
Sometimes I feel as if I am being interviewed by potential customers asking such questions. I find that I can give them a ridiculous range ($80-1800!) and they nod and say "mmm-hmmm, okay..." and then tell me that it's going to go in their living room and they have had it for x years and haven't done anything with it yet, blahblahblah... THAT"S when I get real interested.

I make it a point to slow down and listen ( & try to snap out of my whirlwind framer and/or loudmouth boss mode) and just chat with them and be the friendly neighborhood framer that I am!

I tend to say things like "we can work out a frame on almost any budget..." and "it's really easy to spend plenty of money on a frame, but you certainly don't have to..." If they're really looking to spend very little, I try to at least pitch a simple dry mount on fome core job.

So, in brief, I try to look at a question like that as less of a straightforward request for a firm dollar amount and more as a "getting to know you" query.

Did I answer the question?

edie the stillgettingtoknowme goddess
 
Geez, seeing myself quoted almost looks like I was gloating. It was just weird timing that as I was editing my original post to say that it wasn't unusual for these people to come back & sometimes even end up spending more I got called to handle that order. Maybe I was. A little.
 
Mrs. Robo here. apologies for using Robo's name, can't seem to find my login details.
Just had to put my two pennorth in here.

Having a bit of a bad day, the phone rang with the usual question.
Asking for a rough size, the lady went on to say it was a picture of a scene with a river in it, and despite asking several times,all she would tell me was the same thing, that it was this scenic picture.
"Does it have a tree to the side of the river?" I asked.
"Yes" she replied.
"And is there a little cottage at the top of the stream?"
"Yes, Yes, thats the one" she replied.
"Oh dear" I went on, "Thats a shame"
"Why's that" she asked
"Well, the fact that the cottage is at the top of the stream makes it about twice the price it would have been if the cottage had been at the bottom of the stream!"
"Oh well, I do like it where it is, so how much will that be then?"
I managed to quote a silly price without laughing out loud, and apologised again for not being able to do better on the price due to the location of the cottage.
 
There ya go Mrs. An educated customer always gets their moniesworth.
 
Originally posted by Val:

Now, we'll see if ol' Al makes it in with his poor Evergreen Slug, or if I've scared the bejeezus out of him with my Ballpark Over-the-Phone Estimate, which, BTW, wasn't $30!!

And can I, after reading that entire thread, keep a straight face while I entice my prey with overpriced, unneccesary, uninformed, used-car-salesman-like framing recommendations?
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Thank you, Grumblers! Al made it in today. His <s>movie poster</s> evergreen slug is a mess...torn, folded, pieces missing, badly water-stained. BUT...he still wants it framed, per my professional (not car-salesman-like) recommendations, to keep it from getting any worse. We talked about a conservator but he didn't want to spend the money, just "do the best you can" with the framing, and so I will.

UV Plexi and spacers, and properly mounted, etc., he didn't want any more expense that matting would add, and NOT DRY MOUNTED (he asked if I could glue it down to flatten it out. I said I wouldn't, and explained why.) It was pretty close to the "ballpark estimate" I gave him on the phone.

Funny, his son, from "So Cal" (southern Calif) was with him, bragging about having had his signed Salvador Dali framed by some shop in Hollywood. Guy was icky. I need a shower.
 
Val have you ever conversed with Marc Lizer of The Canvas Peddler? or read any of his post on TFG? If not do a profile search .
You do realize we have some Framers from all sorts of locations don't you? Maybe you'd like to be a bit more descriptive about who that dali was framed by?
BUDDY
 
Buddy, I wasn't referring to the framer in Hollywood as being icky, but the guy (son of customer) that was telling me about it was. He didn't say anything about the framer in Hollywood, other than his Dali was done there, that's all. Then made a comment about us "country framers" (his words!) and telling his father that he was p***ed about the poster being damaged and that he shouldn't waste his money having it framed. His father felt differently.

And yes, I know about Marc Lizer, he's one of us Grumblers. Very respectable.

What made the guy icky, besides a bad case of body odor, was his drooling on one of our artist's stained glass portfolio and commenting about the anatomy of one of the women in a stained glass piece, and in a pretty crude way. That's what made me feel icky, and that's as descriptive as I'm going to get.
 
Ron?? Now, you started all this! What's that all about??

Jerry...because I've been told that even acrylic shouldn't come in direct contact with the art. Have I misunderstood that?? And because, after all the reading about those doggone MOVIE POSTERS/EVERGREEN SLUGS, I'm so darned paranoid of doing something harmful that I'm taking the advice of some VERY RESPECTABLE people on this forum and using spacers with. Frankly, I'd love to put it directly on that ugly sucker and flatten it out, but...oh, never mind.

Ooor...maybe I'm just taking a used-car-salesman-like approach and tacking an unnecessary charge to the framing order.

Not.

<font size=1>Why do I feel like I'm being picked on?</font size=1>

You're right Ron...RUN, VAL, RUN!!!
 
Jerry...didn't mean to bite off your head. My apologies... I just did a search on spacing with acrylic...you made me look...it appears I'm doing the right thing. Whew.
shutup.gif
 
Also

Not to rain on anyone's parade, however, unless you use acrylic thicker than .118 it will be touching the "art" in the center when using spacers. Unless it is a small piece. Anything 'evergreen slug' size, standard 'framing' thickness will bow in from lack of support.

If you use the .098 fagetaboutit it's touching the art.
 
Because of the differences in thermal properties, it's probably better to have acrylic in contact with the poster than glass. Not perfect - but better.

Nobody's going to fault you for adding spacers, though, Val.

Well, okay, edp is going to suggest you're just doing it to jack up the price, but the rest of us are going to be fine with it.

And my LOL guy was just a knee-jerk response to you comment about Marc Lizer being "very respectible." I always assume Marc is reading, even when he's not posting, and I can't pass up an opportunity to tease him - and you.

Try to remember: I only tease people I like.

There is some debate about whether there is any place for teasing and general shenanigans on a forum like The Grumble and I like to think I have taken on a leadership role in the shenanigans camp.
 
Originally posted by Ron Eggers:

There is some debate about whether there is any place for teasing and general shenanigans on a forum like The Grumble and I like to think I have taken on a leadership role in the shenanigans camp.
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I thought that was why we are here instead of "there."
 
If Ron weren't already Picture Framing God, I'd vote for him too!

Thanks Ron. And thanks for teasing me, makes me feel like I belong here! (Am I gonna be sorry I said that?)

Movie Poster guy made a 50% deposit...I will deduct the spacers cost if I decide not to use them. Frankly, the thing is such a mess that probably having the acrylic holding it down might be (am I gonna be sorry I said this too??) better for it than having it "flopping around loose", (still not going to drymount it!!). It's pretty beat up. Plus, it's going into a 75-profile metal frame (not my choice either, but his budget said so) and there isn't room for a deep spacer.

And edp, if he's still around, can take a flyin' leap. I once worked with car salesmen...we're nowhere near as sleazy! Ha!

What would you do? It's 27" x 41"
 
Frankly, Val, with the customer's informed consent, I would probably dry mount it.

Is he thinking it's potentially valuable? Is he hoping to sell it to fund his retirement?

Or does he have a sentimental attachment and simply want it to look as good as it can in its present, trashed condition?

If you have some ArtCare Restore, and the stuff is working for you, you could use that. But I would not hesitate to mount it permanently after discussing it with Al. Be sure he understands that, once mounted, it can't be unmounted. If crumbling it up and storing it in the garage hasn't already severely compromised its collection value, mounting it will finish it off.

But it will look better and probably keep it from falling apart altogether.

Then he can decide. If you like consent forms, have him sign one (but be aware that they really don't mean a lot.)

I am hardly qualified to be a Picture Framing God at this time in life because I am doing almost no picture framing at all.

Not sure I want to be the Health Insurance God, either. The 27-year-old woman who's at the next desk, and has been there 6-7 years, knows more about claims and plans and state insurance mandates than I will ever know and has become my half-my-age mentor.

I'd settle for Sultan of Shenanigans but my current tagline probably better describes my role here.
 
Okay, I hereby designate you the Sultan of Shenanigans, Ron.

It's official.
Where your crown, turban, or whatever a sultan wears, in good health!

PS
I tried to use an html tag to strike some words and it wouldn't let me. What's up with that?
 
Sultan.jpg


Ah. HTML. Other than dogs and squirrels and Wall-Buddies, possibly my favorite topic.

Did you do <strike>this</strike> or something else?

Something else won't work.
 
Well, I thought that is what I did but evidently not.

Sigh. It's tough being a blonde.
 
Deb, I accidentally learned the cross-out thing from Baer. Do this..
< s >word you want to cross out, then < / s>
except without the spaces in between each character, I put them in so it wouldn't do <s>this</s> that.

Ron, your Shenanigan Sultan looks like a magic lantern genie. If we rub your <s>belly</s> lantern, will you grant us a wish?
 
Thanks Jerry, I think I'll call him about that.
With or without spacers??
 
Whenever a customer asks how much will it cost to frame a piece (they will hold thier hands up to show approximately what the size is) I show them a framed sample on the wall that is close to the size they demostrated with their hands and ask them if it is close to that size on the wall? They will say yes. I then grab my ruler and get a quick measure, then I ask them what type of moulding they think they would like, they point at a moulding and I quickly enter the specs (with a basic mat) into Lifesaver and give them a price. If they say the price is too high, I point out other mouldings that are less "expensive". Sometimes they come back and sometimes they don't.
 
That "ball park" guy called yesterday.. didn't like the $200-500 range... so I upped it to $1,000-5,000... :D

He said he'd bring his print in when Shar was around. Guess he didn't like my guessing. :D
 
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